gbmarius luksys
NewbieNewbie
Joined: 30 May 2020
Posts: 4
Thanks given: 1
Thanks received: 1
30 May 2020 - 2:14pm

Betswagger refuse to pay

38 replies • Last post

Hello

I did open account with Betswagger and made deposit from my personal bank account. I did win £9000.01 and wanted to withdraw. They requesting to verify your account on the first time of withdrawal so i did provide them with all needed documents.When they reviewed and seen my balance in my account was £9000.01 they banned my account straight away and emailed me by saying they closing my account and refunding my deposits back.I asked why and why they refunding my deposits back worth of £140 instead of my winnings of £9000.01 they simply said we dont need to give you a reason and suggested to read their terms and conditions.  I said its fraudly activity as i did everything legaly and fairly ..then they replied by saying there was suspicious activity..i asked what suspicious activity as i did nothing wrong. Then they just emailed that all im getting is deposits refunded and its final decision. Just simply as that they keep my £9000.01 for themselves. Please help me with this ..help me to get my winnings paid out to me.

Many thanks in advance 

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
2 June 2020 - 5:34am
#1

Welcome Marius, and I am sorry that this has happened to you.

Ok, first up your profile says you're in the UK. From what I can see Betswagger are not licensed by the UK Gambling Commission. All they have is a Curacao "license", which is worth less than the paper it is written on. They are breaking UK law by allowing you to pay there, and you have no recourse if they rip you off as Curacao has no consumer protection or dispute resolution service.

Stick to UKGC licensed casinos in future. They aren't perfect by a long shot, but at least if you have a problem you have an official dispute resolution process and legal avenues to pursue if that fails.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbmarius luksys
NewbieNewbie
Joined: 30 May 2020
Posts: 4
Thanks given: 1
Thanks received: 1
4 June 2020 - 6:12pm
#2

Thank you.I learnt it hard way,just sad thing is why people in UK are allowed to fall for this,anything to do with Curacao should be banned.Now they scam and this country do nothing about it.Apart that i hope what goes around that turns around one day.Thank you for your reply

mohamedkh

auKgoods
GamblerGambler
Joined: 2 May 2020
Posts: 68
Thanks received: 5
6 June 2020 - 10:42am
#3

If you can't resolve under a gaming licence, please be aware that all companies will also be governed by corporate law and in many cases consumer law.

Not having a gaming licence is no excuse for them to get off scott free - in fact it should make a corporate law infringement a slam dunk. For £9,000 pounds, it may be worth taking to a lawyer.

marius luksys

gbmarius luksys
NewbieNewbie
Joined: 30 May 2020
Posts: 4
Thanks given: 1
Thanks received: 1
6 June 2020 - 11:16am
#4

Thank you..i think you made a good point.9K is a lot of money and even if i get half of it after all the hassle,still a win.

Thank you

auKgoods
GamblerGambler
Joined: 2 May 2020
Posts: 68
Thanks received: 5
6 June 2020 - 11:24am
#5

Your welcome, I'm dealing with a $150k (~£75k) issue with ignition at the moment and getting a lot of value from my lawyer.
Understand we're in different countries but feel free to reach out if any questions.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
6 June 2020 - 12:38pm
#6

I hate to say this, because it should be right but you've got very little hope with a lawyer Marius. You're dealing with a casino owned by unknown people in an unknown country running a site through a Curacao shelf corporation that in many other cases would be legally owned by another shell corporation in another uncooperative jurisdiction. By the time you untangle that mess, if it is even possible, you would be well past £9000 in legal fees. By all means ask someone, but I can guarantee you that it will not be as simple as Kgoods seems to think.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbmarius luksys
NewbieNewbie
Joined: 30 May 2020
Posts: 4
Thanks given: 1
Thanks received: 1
6 June 2020 - 12:45pm
#7

you probably right..but knowing all that why the whole world allows that to happen..its same like i would walk into your house,take your money and walk out,why i get prison sentence and police will find me anywhere in the world,but scammers as these just allowed to keep stealing people's money.So wrong

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
9 December 2020 - 11:13pm
#8

This is looking to be a common theme...

Been a customer with Betswagger for 2 years, never had any issues. 2 days ago I managed to win 130k over the space of a day through sports bets and a slot game called Money Train.

I got two massive payouts from it totalling 100k, the other 30k was from sports accumilators that I got really lucky with.

Upon conformation of my winnings things started to get weird.

Responses are few and far with vague excuses, and the customer service has been awful in regards to this situation.

My account was first deducted 90k while they conducted an "investigation", and left me with 12k. I turned that into 32k. No warning, Banned From the site. At that point I was getting weak feedback with absolutely no intention of responding.

Absolute joke. Stay away. Dishonest and unfair.

CL-Ed

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
10 December 2020 - 12:51am
#9

Sorry OC2012. That is horrible but sadly not unexpected due to the reports we've received about their criminal behaviour. BetSwagger are on our blacklist here.

Like I suggested to Marius above, you're in the UK so stick to UKGC regulated sites. At least then you have legal recourse if things go pear shaped.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
10 December 2020 - 1:00am
#10

I doubt I'll ever bet again if I'm honest.

130k man. That's just criminal. And I know they are not based in the UK but if they are not allowed to operate here does that then make me invalid?

I would like to know if I could pursue this further. This isn't right.

The last message I received not too long ago said that I was banned for fraud 🤷‍♂️ The responses and lack of help is apparent in all of their correspondence.

Absolute joke.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
10 December 2020 - 1:16am
#11

I understand totally.

You can try contacting a lawyer but read my post above for how that is likely to play out. There are many very good reasons why these criminal operations set themselves up using networks of shelf companies in banana republic jurisdictions, and accountability to their customers is not one of them.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
10 December 2020 - 1:22am
#12

But shouldn't the accusation of fraud carry criminal element into it, wouldn't the police have to be notified? If they can't prove fraud, then surely they would have to pay up considering there is no reason to withhold the winnings simply because, they dont want to pay it?

Defeats the whole object of betting.

If anyone is guilty of fraud right now its betswagger.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
10 December 2020 - 4:42am
#13

Yes indeed, you are right. But the problem is who is going to investigate? Authorities in Curacao where the casino is supposedly "licensed" could not care less, and what's more the people operating the casino have probably never even set foot on the island. If you contact the UKGC they are just going to tell you that you're playing illegally at an unlicensed casino so there is nothing they can do.

Additionally the operator has probably made it as difficult as possible to find out who they really are and where they are located in reality. So even if you manage to dig all that up and somehow drag the operator to court in their home country, then you probably find that they have deleted your account and there is no evidence that anything happened at all.

You see where I'm going with this? Nothing is impossible but I've never heard of anyone tracking down and prosecuting a fraudulent casino operator via tinpot jurisdictions like Curacao. That's why they are the rogue casino licensing jurisdiction of choice.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
10 December 2020 - 4:59am
#14

I have evidence. I have every email of correspondence, every lie/promise/excuse, photo evidence of my balance in different stages of play, photo evidence of them crediting me with my winnings/confiscating them, photo evidence of false accusations of fraud, and evidence of them assuring me that the balance of 30k that was in my account prior to them banning me was indeed safe.

I'm just livid man. To win so much in such a good and enjoyable way, then to have it taken from you for no reason other than a fabricated allegation by some smug shitweasal that doesn't wanna pay out is utter bollocks.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
11 December 2020 - 4:25am
#15

I'm sorry I don't know what else to tell you. It is what this casino does. They are not going to pay that money and there is very little you can do to make them.

All I can think is that if you deposited there via a credit card then you could contact your card issuer and file a chargeback for all your deposits made within the last 90 days (or whatever the allowable window is). I know that is like shutting the gate after the horse has bolted but at least you least you could get the money you deposited back before they ripped you off.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
13 December 2020 - 12:43pm
#16

So far they have given me back £10k and that's now in my bank account. But in doing so have shot themselves In the foot by changing the withdrawal limits which is something they claimed for days was out of their hands. There was never any reason to deny me any of it, just all lies.

So I've taken the £10k and offered a reasonable settlement figure.

See what happens next?

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
14 December 2020 - 1:14am
#17

Wow, well done. Its disgusting that you should even have to consider a "settlement figure". They should be paying you all of what you won. Good luck, fingers crossed for you.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
14 December 2020 - 2:05am
#18

I know right, I've been messaging them constantly today, same shit though.

I told William, now that we have resolved the withdraw issues, you can go ahead and put that £120k into my bank account. To which they have replied with the usual crap, I'm banned because of fraud, apparently have 2 accounts so that's a breach of terms, being investigated yada yada yada...

I told him I was wise to his game on Monday and that I've sat here and watched them all chat shit for the past 5 days simply because they dont wanna pay out. I told em they have been rumbled, just pay up. But then they turned around and called me a scammer 😂

I think I've bled all the blood I'm gonna get out of this stone. However, what do you make of this. Relax Gaming, the company that made the game Money Train that I won £120k on, are actually licensed by the UKGC. So if I have been able to play a game of theirs, by an overseas company who's licence doesnt stretch to ours, and I've won a game one is saying is possible while the other is saying is impossible and a glitch, do I have grounds for misleading game/fraud? Could I get one company through the other or woumd the UKGC help me out on his instance??

I'm gonna chase it up tommorow with UKGC and Trading Standards.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
14 December 2020 - 2:08am
#19

I feel bad for people like Marius.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
14 December 2020 - 2:16am
#20

Its definitely worth a try. I'm not 100% sure, but would assume that if Relax Gaming are UKGC licensed their games should not be offered at unlicensed casinos to UK customers. You may have an avenue to pursue them for the money through the UKGC.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
14 December 2020 - 2:26am
#21

That's what I'm thinking. It's worth a shot.

What would I get back though? Originally I put in around £1338 of my own money to begin with on monday morning. By midnight Tuesday I had £130k in my balance from that first deposit. Now I won £10k with 3 sportsbets that I placed just before they banned me and they won.

They said they estimated my winnings via sportsbets to be under £10k but I have the evidence all 3 bets played out just under £1100.

Therefore the £10k I got back was from my own winning and was untampered with. But the game they say I defrauded and possibly had bugs, what could I get from that as I'd like to get the whole £120k from my winnings.

I'm wondering what I could potentially sue Relax Gamings for. Cos that's what were talking about doing here isnt it, suing a betting company/game supplier.

I was thinking of calling up Visa fraud dept tommorow and ask if I could reclaim all deposits to Pulsion Processing like you said.

I paid for their company info online yesterday and got it this morning.

So betswagger is the online casino that's based in curacao whom I played with, Unisoft Gaming is their affiliates/complaints dept also in curacao I believe but Pulsion Processing Ltd is company that deals with their payments and they are based in Cyprus. I have their Directors name and Address aswell as their Investors name and their Secretary Company.

So I'm dealing with Curacao, Cypriot and UK laws. Tough part is gonna be who has committed a crime, if any, and seeing what legal route I can pursue.

Any ideas would be a great help, cheers.

I've told Betswagger countless times to settle with me for £60k, or that I continue to pursue this through any court means I can to reclaim all monies.

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
14 December 2020 - 11:17pm
#22

Yeah this is what I was talking about before. You're dealing with multiple companies in different jurisdictions and it is all set up to make it as hard as possible to hold anyone to account for anything.

You need to talk to both the UKGC and a lawyer as they would be able to give you a far better idea of how much pursuing this would cost. Also the UKGC may be interested in the information you have dug up on payment processors and directors as they are clearly breaking UK law by allowing you to deposit and play there.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

zaLambino
Gold PlayerGold Player
Lambino's picture
Location: SA
Joined: 14 Apr 2015
Posts: 718
Thanks given: 356
Thanks received: 651
15 December 2020 - 8:49am
#23

What a bummer , I saw similar complaints on LCB forum about this casino pulling similar moves on other players as well , seems like they a terrible casino and basically out to scam players its a damn shame

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
15 December 2020 - 9:40pm
#24
CL-Ed wrote:

Yeah this is what I was talking about before. You're dealing with multiple companies in different jurisdictions and it is all set up to make it as hard as possible to hold anyone to account for anything.

You need to talk to both the UKGC and a lawyer as they would be able to give you a far better idea of how much pursuing this would cost. Also the UKGC may be interested in the information you have dug up on payment processors and directors as they are clearly breaking UK law by allowing you to deposit and play there.

I'm gonna try the UKGC tommorow, see if I can get anywhere with them. In the meantime I've recieved these 2 responses from The NBA and Cyprus Gaming and Casino Supervision Commision. Trying to upload them but not having much luck.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
15 December 2020 - 9:45pm
#25

Response from Cyprus:

Quote:

Following your email below, we would like to inform you that according to the Betting Law of 2019 L.37(I)/2019 (henceforth the "Law"), only betting services on sports or other events by companies which are licensed through the National Betting Authority of Cyprus, are permitted.

Provision of betting services by a company which has not yet been granted a Class B license (online betting) is prohibited within the Republic of Cyprus and their websites are added on the ISP blocking list, which is compiled and maintained by the Authority (https://nba.gov.cy/wp-content/uploads/BlockingListLatest.txt).

Be advised that, the website betswagger.com and all the domains which contain the name "betswagger" are illegal to operate in Cyprus and will remain on the ISP blocking.

In that respect, please be informed that the Authority is not responsible to handle your complaint or assist you in your request.

You can find all the licenced bookmakers at the following website http://nba.gov.cy/en/regulated-entities/registers/class-b//. Please note that licenced bookmakers may only offer their services through a ".com.cy" domain.

You may find additional information in the Authority's announcement, regarding the status of the online gambling in Cyprus in the following link: https://nba.gov.cy/en/advice-to-the-public-on-protection-measures-for-on....

We remain at your disposal for any information or clarifications you may need.

Nicolas Kyranides

On behalf of the Chairwoman
Compliance and Supervision Department
83 Digeni Akrita,
1070, Nicosia
+357 22 881800
www.nba.gov.cy/en

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
16 December 2020 - 6:39am
#26

Sorry your posts triggered the anti-spam system and I may have deleted one too many posts in the clean up.

So the one above is from gaming people in Cyprus but I can't see why they would be relevant. Betswagger claims to be Curacao licensed and you're in the UK, right? Their response is basically telling you that they only care whether the site allows people from Cyprus to bet, and if so it would be against their laws. Not sure how that helps you though.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbOC2012
FreerollerFreeroller
Joined: 9 Dec 2020
Posts: 11
Thanks received: 1
29 December 2020 - 12:17am
#27

Update.

I am currently not getting any correspondence from Betswagger/Usoft Gaming anymore.

So far I have complained to Curacao Egaming twice and recieved responses from William/Felicia. I have contacted the NBA and Cyprus Gaming Casino Supervision Commission who both say that no laws are being broken in Cyprus with Pulsion Processing acting as Usoftgaming's Payment Provider, even though they are based in Cyprus.

I had a chap email my predicament to a friend of his who works on the Curacao Gaming Commision, but I can't confirm or deny who this person is.

I emailed the MP in charge of Digital, Culture, Media and Sport and got a reply which I have attached, so I've sent everything I have to the UKGC and see if there is anything they can do.

I have a solicitor interested who's whose field is this exact thing, but waiting to hear back from the UKGC. I have attached the response I got from the Dept Digital, Media, Culture & Sport.

Regards

Andreas

20201228_192451.jpg
auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
30 December 2020 - 4:51am
#28

Wow you found someone who works for the Curacao Gaming Commission? For real? That must be the easiest job in the world, just stroll down to the beach and count the "license" money every day. At least he should have a lot of free time to look at your case.

Good luck man, I really doubt you're ever going to see any of that money but I'm behind you 100%.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

gbLeyshon54
NewbieNewbie
Joined: 3 Jan 2021
Posts: 1
Thanks received: 1
3 January 2021 - 4:51pm
#29

Hi guys, I'm upto 30k in sports bet wins all in high profile matches, currently going through verification so I'll update you on what excuses they provide me now I try to withdrawal £30,000

CL-Ed

auCL-Ed
StaffStaff
CL-Ed's picture
Location: Sydney
Joined: 7 Sep 2007
Posts: 9936
Thanks given: 5863
Thanks received: 5038
4 January 2021 - 12:24am
#30

Best of luck Leyshon54. Let us know how you get on.

Always play it safe! Consult our list of rogue casinos and warnings before depositing at a new casino.
Post in our forums to earn CLchips which can be used to buy real prizes in our CLchips shop.

Post new comment

Have something to say? Agree or disagree? Tell us what you think!

Login using your social network account
Or log in with a Casino Listings account

Login or register to post comments

Registering for an account takes less than a minute and you will be brought right back here to comment afterwards.